Now get in the pit and try to love someone.
Thoughts relating to members being banned and website policy...
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Thoughts relating to members being banned and website policy...Connie Jo says (30 May '10)**NOTE**...for those replying in my discussion, please keep it respectful and clean. The purpose and point of my disscussion here is to encourage re-consideration of current website policy relating to bannings, and to possibly in the future include a warning at the time of violation prior to ban. As well as, to implement a policy of which the length of ban is fair based upon severity of violation. Lastly, to point out the benefit of the most recent bans not being worthy of what is lost to the website by comparison. Thank you in advance for keeping any discussion & debate replies respectful. :)
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I don't participate in many websites, as I'm very selective, haha. However, I've visited several over the years, and do participate in a major NFL Chiefs website, etc..I understand that rules and policies are very necessary, considering human behavior, personality clashes, conflict with culture differences, and so on. People naturally will not get along, and drama or conflict is a reality in every aspect of our lives...family, work, school, public environments, including the internet. I also understand these rules and policies must be enforced fairly and religiously in order for them to be effective.
That said, the majority of public websites enforce levels of punishment depending upon severity of violation. There are typically warnings issued prior to being banned, at least one...followed by levels of banishment from one week to a month, a year, or permanently...depending upon severity and repetition of a member violating rules.
I don't know if Angel, Theresa, or Tangie were warned or not, possibly. However, what I do know is this...
All three of these most recent banned members contributed to this website in positive ways of far greater value than not, and of value exceeding any benefit of their not being allowed to particpate with permanent banning.
They are missed of course by friends, but more importantly is what will be missed on the website of priceless irreplaceable value without their participation. The first to note and consider of priceless value were the contributions Angel made with habitually posting news, updates, information & knowledge relating to Kid Rock, TBT, etc.. Theresa's priceless contribution to the website was through her remarkably artistic, creative, and unique published poems and stories. Additionally, each brought much personality and interesting character to the website through their senses of humor, rhyming talents, etc..
I also know, that though a website has thousands of members, only a fraction will participate loyally on a regular basis contributing to the website...which the three banned members did do, also of priceless value in my opinion. The fewer members a website has, of which participate regularly...the more boring and mundane it shall become, and interest overall will eventually be lost with interaction among only a few.
It's also a proven fact, that some conflict is healthy and vital for a successful website, though that conflict indeed should be, and can take place among members respectively...without explicit name calling, and so on. Conflict also draws interest and participation naturally...we humans can't seem to avoid it, haha. This of course is why reality show ratings shoot through the roof, as well as soap opera's, lol.
I don't know if the banning's of Angel, Theresa, and Tangie are permanent or not, but I certainly hope not...as the entire website will suffer as a result in various ways. The ladies certainly without doubt violated current policy and therefore were deserving of their bans, but in my opinion, of which may be of little to no value...a temporary cooling off period ban would've sufficed as punishment in this case. I did read the drama discussions in question, so am voicing my opinion with facts & knowledge related, rather than not.
If possible...it would be appreciated if banned members positive contributions, such as comments left on personal pages...were not deleted along with the member. For instance...Theresa and Angel both had left comments on my page, of which I considered very sentimental. They're now gone permanently. I did nothing wrong, yet with those comments removed...I was punished to some extent as well. Theresa's poetry and stories are gone with her page deleted...I typically read poems and/or stories on her page often when I visit KRC...some of which I found emotionally beneficial, through initiating thoughts in various aspects...as reading such can sometimes sooth ones soul. I've lost that benefit now with the website too, as a result of Theresa's banishment and her page being banned right along with her.
Concluding thoughts...every one of us has the capability to find ourselves caught up in conflict or drama. However, I know for a fact that it is possible to make ones point, or criticize anothers point, debate a point of view, and so on...respectively, without it having to violate policies. It may take more effort, but in the end it's worth it to oneself, and to everyone else. We all suffer when members are banned, that are our friends, and/or contribute in priceless ways with our finding enjoyment in coming here. It's unfair to those of us who did not violate policy when we lose due to others...keep that in mind when you find yourself wanting to attack in ways that violate policy...you're hurting many indirectly.
80Filed Under: Community Forum Archive
**NOTE**...for those replying in my discussion, please keep it respectful and clean. The purpose and point of my disscussion here is to encourage re-consideration of current website policy relating to bannings, and to possibly in the future include a warning at the time of violation prior to ban. As well as, to implement a policy of which the length of ban is fair based upon severity of violation. Lastly, to point out the benefit of the most recent bans not being worthy of what is lost to the website by comparison. Thank you in advance for keeping any discussion & debate replies respectful. :)
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I don't participate in many websites, as I'm very selective, haha. However, I've visited several over the years, and do participate in a major NFL Chiefs website, etc..
I understand that rules and policies are very necessary, considering human behavior, personality clashes, conflict with culture differences, and so on. People naturally will not get along, and drama or conflict is a reality in every aspect of our lives...family, work, school, public environments, including the internet. I also understand these rules and policies must be enforced fairly and religiously in order for them to be effective.
That said, the majority of public websites enforce levels of punishment depending upon severity of violation. There are typically warnings issued prior to being banned, at least one...followed by levels of banishment from one week to a month, a year, or permanently...depending upon severity and repetition of a member violating rules.
I don't know if Angel, Theresa, or Tangie were warned or not, possibly. However, what I do know is this...
All three of these most recent banned members contributed to this website in positive ways of far greater value than not, and of value exceeding any benefit of their not being allowed to particpate with permanent banning.
They are missed of course by friends, but more importantly is what will be missed on the website of priceless irreplaceable value without their participation. The first to note and consider of priceless value were the contributions Angel made with habitually posting news, updates, information & knowledge relating to Kid Rock, TBT, etc.. Theresa's priceless contribution to the website was through her remarkably artistic, creative, and unique published poems and stories. Additionally, each brought much personality and interesting character to the website through their senses of humor, rhyming talents, etc..
I also know, that though a website has thousands of members, only a fraction will participate loyally on a regular basis contributing to the website...which the three banned members did do, also of priceless value in my opinion. The fewer members a website has, of which participate regularly...the more boring and mundane it shall become, and interest overall will eventually be lost with interaction among only a few.
It's also a proven fact, that some conflict is healthy and vital for a successful website, though that conflict indeed should be, and can take place among members respectively...without explicit name calling, and so on. Conflict also draws interest and participation naturally...we humans can't seem to avoid it, haha. This of course is why reality show ratings shoot through the roof, as well as soap opera's, lol.
I don't know if the banning's of Angel, Theresa, and Tangie are permanent or not, but I certainly hope not...as the entire website will suffer as a result in various ways. The ladies certainly without doubt violated current policy and therefore were deserving of their bans, but in my opinion, of which may be of little to no value...a temporary cooling off period ban would've sufficed as punishment in this case. I did read the drama discussions in question, so am voicing my opinion with facts & knowledge related, rather than not.
If possible...it would be appreciated if banned members positive contributions, such as comments left on personal pages...were not deleted along with the member. For instance...Theresa and Angel both had left comments on my page, of which I considered very sentimental. They're now gone permanently. I did nothing wrong, yet with those comments removed...I was punished to some extent as well. Theresa's poetry and stories are gone with her page deleted...I typically read poems and/or stories on her page often when I visit KRC...some of which I found emotionally beneficial, through initiating thoughts in various aspects...as reading such can sometimes sooth ones soul. I've lost that benefit now with the website too, as a result of Theresa's banishment and her page being banned right along with her.
Concluding thoughts...every one of us has the capability to find ourselves caught up in conflict or drama. However, I know for a fact that it is possible to make ones point, or criticize anothers point, debate a point of view, and so on...respectively, without it having to violate policies. It may take more effort, but in the end it's worth it to oneself, and to everyone else. We all suffer when members are banned, that are our friends, and/or contribute in priceless ways with our finding enjoyment in coming here. It's unfair to those of us who did not violate policy when we lose due to others...keep that in mind when you find yourself wanting to attack in ways that violate policy...you're hurting many indirectly.
Forum category:
Thank you Kid Rock:)
I meant I'm giving credit to Ronny for re-instating them, haha. I don't blame him, nor whomever did the banning. The rules were clearly violated according to posted policy at the time of bannings. I do hope website banning policy is more clearly defined at some point, and outlined with appropriate bans for severity of violation, as well as noted warnings issued.
Why do you want to know "the truth"? I agree, we likely will never know more than we know now, but why should we really, of what benefit is it? The main objective is to clarify website policy & banning guidelines so we will all understand more clearly in the future of what to expect or not if rules are violated...no?
I personally tend to think, giving benefit of doubt, that Ronny is more active than it may appear. I can only imagine the time one has to spend reading through not only blogs and discussions, but members pages as well to make sure all is well...assuming he does of course. Then there is also the duty imposed on him as moderator with writing and posting news, videos, etc.. There are techinical issues that arise of which also require attention.
If I remember correctly when info was posted for moderator applicants...duties also included moderating this website as well as the Congregation website. I don't know if Ronny is allowed to have help moderating or not, or with other duties...certainly if not it's a huge undertaking for one person, and still quite a job to do, all considered...even if he's allowed help.
I appreciate Ronny, but, not going to blame him or cantonize him until I know the truth. Probably never will, which is fine. Hope he does more administrating actively on the forum so this situation does not occur again.
I'm giving credit to Ronny, it's what feels 'right'. :)
No idea blue, But Thank You to whoever's decision it was
And ofcourse all of you that stepped up on our behalf.
Do we know for certain that the banning and unbanning credit goes to Ronny? Think this might have gone further up.
Actually, haha...not going to be much shopping for a cruise until I have the money set aside to cover the entire cost of the cruise & related expenses covered first. 'IF' I have any extra, then I might do a bit of shopping. Fortunately I don't require much in clothing, haha...I'm pretty simple & traditional for the most part...pair of jeans, sandals, shirt...about does it. :)
I'm gonna 'try' to work in a set of weights in my budget, as I really do need to do some toning...not just for a cruise, but for myself. With being ill the last year off & on due to emotional factors relating to ending my marriage...I've lost muscle, not done as much hard labor around the house as I normally did. Winter's coming on now...perfect time to re-build muscle with less family activities than in the summer. :)
YEEHAW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I am so fricken happy!!! Theresa...Next time you find yourself in a similar tempting situation as the one that resulted in your being banned, of which knowing human nature likely may happen, hahaha...PM me, I'll be your sounding board when you're rightfully angry, hahaha. :)
Ronny...Thank you!!! I had a feeling you were by far too reasonable and fair, been around too long to not 'get it' when it comes to Kid Rock's website family and their at times dysfunctional behavior, hahaha...and therefore would not impose a permanent ban...'THIS TIME'. You're one of the good guys still left out there. :)
I hope you understand my efforts with this situation were based upon not knowing if there are any guidelines for ban warnings, length of ban based upon severity of violation, and standing up simply for what I also believe to be fair and reasonable. :)
Thank you so much Ronny for being fair, reasonable, understanding...and allowing the girls back!! :)
Good to see you back, girl!!! Made my weekend. The powers that be......LOL!
I want to thank Connie Jo and the other members who contributed to this thread. I love you all. That being said I do have to defend Ronny who may be getting the heat for banning not only Angel but also Tangie and me. I take full responsibility for my actions, for my banishment. I read the rules posted and knowingly violated them. That was my fault and my mistake not Ronny's. He was just doing the job designated to him. I was just recently informed that I got a reprieve from what could have been a life sentence. Thank you for that. I will set my page shortly and put my writings back up. For those of you that read my work and find solace in the words, it means so much to me. Yes, I'm a Kid Rock fan. I'm a Paradime, Uncle Kracker, Eminem, D 12 fan. And I think the Twisted Brown Trucker band is kick ass. I appreciate this site and the people in it. Not all of us may like one another, but we all do share a love of great music and the artists who inspire us in different ways throughout our lives. So, with that, I'm back! Send me a friend request and I will add you to my page as soon I set it back to the way it was. I'm a little busy right now and it may take some time, but I will get to it. Many blessings of love and light to all.
Hey Gang,
Thanks so much for the kind words and God Bless those that kept me sane lol.
Unlike T I havent heard I have been reprieved but the Ban box was removed and i was able to sign on so Here I am.
I concur with Belle. I We were told the consequences of our actions and Ronny was Doing his job.
I hear you loud and clear. The uncertainty and randomness of this action really puts a damper on any activity here.
By petition, just mean a list of those individuals who believe the banning process needs to be changed and those three ladies banned need to be allowed back here as soon as possible to participate.
My reason for doing so is so that the management can put a "face" on those who want to see positive change.
In all actuality, the number of folks who post daily and form the community on the public boards and chat, are usually a very small handful of the total amount of members. If I remember right, I read once that only 12% of forum members post, then still smaller the number of active contributing folks.
Which is why I feel this latest punishment is excessive. Obviously someone else did too, because there is Belle. Hellllooooooo! LOL!
Now where are Tangie and Angel (who forever in my mind after will be linked as "T&A?" Hope they are back as well.
Wonderful news, welcome back!
Also, though already stated I don't participate with many interactive websites, I do know that the majority have 'cooling off bans', as well as, probation bans in addition to permanent bans.
Zero tolerance isn't realistic or reasonable for a website such as this one, and considering the very broad range of possible violations, it being unclear as to what constitutes a penalty of permanent ban.
I agree with you entirely Jocelyn (blue...it doesn't feel right me calling you blue, haha).
As well, a petition is a great idea if the banned members are not informed how permanent or not their ban is. It's my understanding they've not been told anything other than you have been banned...that in itself doesn't seem right. They are all left in limbo wondering, as well as those members who care...me & you included. :)
You are right also, in that many members aren't clear what constitutes banning or doesn't. One reason I do hesitate in starting a petition, in addition to starting this particular discussion thread...they could ban me next, saying I was stirring drama by doing so. I believe I've been respectful in my standing up for what I believe to be fair or unfair, right or wrong...but what I think & what 'they' think may not be the same, haha. :)
HI sweetie!! Thanks so much for the welcome back! It feels good to be back! I missed everyone, including YOU! My absence for 5 months was necessary however for personal reasons. :)
Connie Jo, soo very glad to see you back. Always a pleasure to read your posts. You were missed.
Connie, that's fine. Just want them to see a list of real names and faces when folks ask that policy be changed. Many, I think, are fearful of commenting due to the unclear banning policies themselves.
Let's hope all the management is reading these threads, and see if things change, but in the next few days, if nothing is heard or answers recieved to pm's and emails, then I may throw up a blog myself.
Nixon was the first to reference the "silent majority" in his politics, and here, I feel real numbers might suprise those who run this site and cause them to reconsider the harshness of the current lifetime ban approach.
Again, considering many here have said far worse and never been the recipient of consequences, I feel this ban for these three ladies should be overturned, and new policies created that provide enforced cooling off periods, should that be necessary, and probationary status, should that be necessary.
Thanks for taking the time to respond, appreciated.
With regards to you LC...
I agree, it is "about US"...which is why we are speaking out. I personally, listen to the messages within "Bobby's" (& TBT's since they co-write many) lyrics more than most, back to the Grits era. "If it's real you'll feel it"...and I do, both lyrically and musically. I have no doubt, that Kid Rock would relate to this discussion wholeheardedly, since it's point is standing up for what one believes is fair or unfair, right or wrong, of which directly affects one and those they care about.
The particular members banned contributed greatly to this site more positively than not, in more ways than one...including posting daily news, articles, videos, & links of interest and value related directly to Kid Rock and TBT. These valuable & beneficial contributions are missed by many within the membership.
I presume you have not read the discussion thread in it's entirety, and therefore misunderstood, considering your reply above. This discussion in point is not about 'drama', nor clicky friends, nor domination of the website by members. This discussion is a debate relating to current website rules, policy, enforcement of, and the punishment being in accordance with the severity of violation...of which in reality, is indeed about "US", the entire membership being affected by such..."US". It is the opinion of many members, just not a few on one side or the other...that these most recent bannings were harsh and unfair 'IF' they are permanent bannings. What is lost to the website if the bannings are permanent, considering the positive and valuable contributions to the website of these particular 3 banned members...is of far greater value to "US" than that of their being banned permanently.
Additionally, in my original discussion post, as well as in comment replies...all 3 banned members have been represented fairly, though one of two is on opposing sides...there are no sides being taken, no 'clicks' represented by me.
Well, I have mixed emotions about organizing a petition. In reality...this discussion in itself is such, as many entered and voiced their opinions on the bannings. Don't know if this discussion was read by those with influence or power to reinstate the 3 members banned or not, but I hope they read it and took it all into consideration. I do believe that as loyal & actively participating members, we have a right to speak out relating to the rules & policies of the website pertaining to us members directly...just as one has a right to speak out related to how our government runs our country, laws & policy implemented. With our government we have the opportunity of change through election, lobbying, petitions of course.
Respectively speaking...I personally feel that it is a site moderator/administrators duty to know & understand how members feel about such website issues, as much as it is their job to protect members through rules/policy...as well as, take all factors, advantages & disadvantages to the website and it's members under consideration, then make a decision relating to rules, policy, and violation of such...that is best overall for all members and the website both. It's possible Ronny, or whomever...have done this already. Unfortunately we don't know...as there has been no interaction or communication with members related to this issue in particular.
I can only trust that Ronny, possibly others in control of such decisions...have fairly examined and considered the policy, rules, violations, and with relationship to the most recent bannings.
A direct petition can be a risky thing...can go either way...positively or negatively, which is why I opted for a discussion to allow others to voice their views, as well as myself. Many people will take offense when feeling pressured directly by others to go against their own beliefs/views, decisions related to doing their job.
If these three ladies were folks that posted a couple of weekends of month, I'd agree. But these folks were all vital here, at least to me, and I think many others due to the sheer volume of information they all shared.
Comparitively, the punishment is excessive and those that disagree with that policy are petioning that it be changed. I think we want "them" to be "US." K?
(out of place, responding to LC's comment)
Bobbie?
This is not kindergarten class. This is a public OPINION board. Nobody is going to agree with everyone on everything. Wherever you have this many people relegated to one place, you can count on at least 3 things.
1) Arguements - Yes, people are going to argue. Whether its about Bobbie, his music, or the topic of the day, people are going to disagree. I am sure some sad lil people will not post anything when they disagree, but anyone with a voice will do so.
2) Cliques - Some people are going to relate to one person or one group of people more then they do others. Some people are gonna meet up with people they meet, and once they do that all rules change. All of a sudden, certain people are no longer just names on a screen, they are actual friends, and you will stick with them thru everything.
3) Rational vs irrational. Some people are rational thinkers, while others are totally irrational. When the two forces collide, its inevitable that flames will erupt.
Shit happens, the main thing that needs to be remembered is that we are all adults. We do not have to be friends with everyone, agree with everyone, or even give a shit about everyone. This is not a church messageboard, this is not Neil Diamond's messageboard. This is Kid Rock's messageboard. Be you, be yourself, say what u want, when u wanna say it.
I am very disapointed to see all this crazy bullshit drama going on about the whole thing! Is this site about Kid & the Fans??? Or about clicky friends?? I drop in pretty often--I have watched the site evolve & that si what it is doing--it has to stay open & free & not be dominated--I mean no disrespect to the banned members or thier friends & I understand they are upset ..get over it It's NOT about them or YOU--it's about "US" do you not listen to Bobbie's message in his songs?? Rock on all!!
I don't feel right with this ban for a number of reasons. First, far worse historically has occurred here with no banning applied. No group thread warnings during the action either, which I feel, as Connie suggested earlier, are vital in a hot headed contentious environment that a Kid Rock audience brings to the fan club.
The last, and most troubling, is the fact that despite some outragious behavior in the past by some of our male members, in this case, only three females are banned. Smacks discriminatory to me and makes me uncomfortable.
No reason why the delete X can also be programmed to flash red if the moderator feels your statement is worthy of warning. That way all reading know to move along to avoid conflict, or change direction.
Kid Rock brings a varied audience. Not everybody can like everybody. There has to be a way we can work this out, without resorting to the earlier banning and the loss of these ladies.
yup, no argument from me... he definately could have done that! Like I said, not one of his best moments.
Thanks Dee.
the howard stern videos.....
Okay, I'm intrigued. What video? What did I miss?
Blue, this is a great idea! Your so smart!
Connie, pls forgive in advance if this is too much for you to do, I know you are very busy (and shopping for a cruise, lol).
Would you organize a blog/petition, of your writing, that would allow us all to sign to forward to KRC management? I would like us all to express in numbers and names how vital to the continuation to this forum, a vast number of us feel that the recent banning should be overturned for all indivduals banned recently.
As I mentioned previously, in my opinion, a 30 day ban, then possibly a probationary return, is all that is warranted in this recent situation. To ban three so participatory, marketing organized, contributory individuals for life is unacceptably cruel, and contrary to the nature of this forums.
I would like to see them all be allowed to participate again as soon as possible. I would be very grateful if you'd agree to organize this under your header, and see that it gets to all the appropriate "powers that be....," LOL.
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